boot canting

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boot canting

Post by t-nut on Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:34 pm

Hi all, bad timing to lose a great resource! I'm embarking on my first season of hardbooting. I've got some Deeluxe 325s and I am wondering about setting them up, specifically, how to set up the canting. There's a lot of information out there about binding canting, but not much about boot canting.

At present I'm running F2 race TI with no canting, just 3 * toe and heel lift respectively.

Can anybody offer some insights?

Thanks!

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t-nut

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Re: boot canting

Post by teach on Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:55 pm

I'd say just leave them straight until you have a clear reason to tweak. I eventuially canted my cuffs inward a bit, to accomodate outward cant on the binding (feet tilted, legs less so). But this is a pretty minor tweak.

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Re: boot canting

Post by ibrussell on Wed Nov 15, 2017 9:05 pm

I try to start with my boots flat 90 deg. Are you bow leg or knock knee? Mark middle of knees, with boots on tape a string let it pendulum down to the middle of the boot adjust the boot cuff so the soles are flat and the string is in the middle of the boot, or just use more binding cant to adjust for bow or knock. Try it, make one adjustment at a time. run it, like it,. push it, don't like go back, like push more.. Good luck. ib Always on the cutting...on obsolete
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Re: boot canting

Post by erazz on Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:16 pm

The more I fiddle with my boots the worse I ride. Found that straight up and down worked best for me.

Definitely stay away from canting inward (made that mistake before). It may feel better on the carpet but sucks for riding.
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Re: boot canting

Post by Corey on Thu Nov 16, 2017 5:36 pm

Skiers have a process where they stand normally on a flat surface and rock their knees side-to-side in unison.  A skilled observer watches the sole pads and sees if one edge lifts first.  That boot gets cant until they lift equally.  

Would that work for us?  No idea, just thought the process looked interesting and seems reasonable for how skis work.  Paging Dr. Beckmann...
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Re: boot canting

Post by AlanMcK on Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:41 pm

Corey, having read Erik's boot set-up advice and corresponded with him about boot cuff can't adjustment that is pretty much the process. Ideally with boots on and buckled up, if your feet are in the position they would be in for a straight slide on skis down a beginner slope, then the soles should be flat on the floor, and the boot cuff pressure should not be biased to either side of either calf. You can achieve this by loosening the cuff cant bolts on the boots, standing in the position and getting an assistant to tighten them. This will deal with the issue of people with different cuff cant angles for either leg.
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Re: boot canting

Post by ursle on Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:05 pm

When I skied I went to a place for proper boot setup, they put me in my boots in front of an X-ray, the X-ray showed my left leg was 1/4” shorter, so they shimmed my left foot to get my pelvis level, then they wanted the center of my knee over the center of my big toe, so they put cants on the outside of my bindings to center my knees over my big toes, wow, so now (then),when I step on a ski I don’t have to lean the knee over to engauge the edge, I simply step on the ski and it’s on edge, better balance and much faster turns, got my nastar down to 4
Snowboards don’t require the center of the knee over the center of the big toe, for snowboards, you set up away from pain, if the outside of your right ankle is killing you, cant that ankle outward to alleviate the pain.
Boot canting is the same, as mentioned, when standing in the boots in the bindings with no liners in the boots, use the boot canting devices to get the cuffs of the boots as equal side to side as you can.
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Re: boot canting

Post by Beckmann AG on Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:40 pm

Cuff alignment isn't the same thing as canting, as the goals and mechanisms are different.
Ideally, you want the cuffs to follow the contour of your lower leg without adversely affecting the inversion/eversion of the ankle joint. If, when you close the boot in a non-weight bearing situation (you, on a bench/chair, with the boot heel on the floor) the boot shell/cuff has predisposed your ankle to either side, then your cuffs are not properly aligned.

(I'd post a link to more info, but apparently I'm on probation.)
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Re: boot canting

Post by TinMan on Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:43 pm

What angles are you running? To my mind: cuff canting is somewhat more important at higher angles. I am somewhat bow legged so I cant my cuffs out somewhat.
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Re: boot canting

Post by teach on Sun Nov 26, 2017 12:46 pm

Corey wrote:Skiers have a process where they stand normally on a flat surface and rock their knees side-to-side in unison.  A skilled observer watches the sole pads and sees if one edge lifts first.  That boot gets cant until they lift equally.  

Would that work for us?  No idea, just thought the process looked interesting and seems reasonable for how skis work.  Paging Dr. Beckmann...

Corey, the canting you're referring to here is the same as we get with wedges/disks. They use plastic strips cut at an angle that go under the bindings. Or plane the boot sole at an angle. I think the OP was asking about cuff canting, aka cuff alignment. If you tweak the binding cant, you may find that the cuff now needs canting in the opposite direction to avoid fighting your legs. But cuffs are usually kind of sloppy with all that foam in there, so you may not notice.

But to Beckmann's point, even before this you'd want to get the foot support fixed. If it's just the forefoot that's "lagging" to make contact to pressure the inside edge, tilting the whole binding to address this will put the ankle in a somewhat awkward position. But many people who have this issue walk on the outsides of their feet, and are used to this ankle position as a lesser of two evils. It can take a while to unwind all this. Beckmann's one-foot riding test is really good at spotting this. Or try skiing, carving turns with both skis equally pressured.

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Re: boot canting

Post by crackaddict on Sun Nov 26, 2017 4:21 pm

teach wrote: Or try skiing

Good advice.  That's what I also tend to say to aspiring hardbooters.
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